05.25.07
The election
Well, well, well.
So not a bad day for FG but a phenomenal one for FF.
I confess myself to be bewildered, resigned and cheerful.
Why people in Meath East elect 2 FF candidates when they don’t have enough schools is beyond me. Poor people voting for FF instead of SF is not such a mystery. Where resources are scarce maybe the Shinnors seemed too willing to give something to the immigrants and who cares about the effin peace process now that we have peace. In one way I approve of the collapse of the smaller parties and the independents – people voted for who they wanted in government not who they thought might influence a government.
In the end, FF sent out the big boys – Cowen, Martin, Ahern and everyone else seemed like amateurs in their shadows.
For Meath West, well I think had Higgins not run, or my sister run or God Almighty run, is all irrelevant. Fianna Fail polled almost 20,000 No. 1’s. Who can challenge that?
So why am I cheerful? Because I’ve decided to stop feeling guilty about the children’s allowance bonanza and the SSIA windfall. I used to look at that money and think – I don’t deserve this – poor people should have this. But the poor people don’t want it! So I’m going to enjoy it. Cheers!
And finally..McDowell..what can you say? His influence has been malign yet he will be missed. But perhaps he’ll be back..
In the meantime, I am off on holidays. Enda, you did a good job. Just because the people don’t want you doesn’t mean you have failed. They have failed themselves. Chin up.
eastmeath.org » Blog Archive » Election 2007 Results: First Thoughts said,
May 25, 2007 at 10:02 pm
[...] Sarah Carey makes some similar points. [...]
Paul Newton said,
May 25, 2007 at 10:25 pm
Hi Sarah,
I find your comments about “poor people” quite offensive, not all SF voters fall into your easy analysis, there are many of us who have shared in the tiger economy, who are not poor but have a social conscience.
IN terms of the result, i think SF ran an beige campaign afraid to take strong positions and got what they deserved, Enda had a strong performance and has done wonders for FG, it’s a pity he allowed Bertie to murder him in the debate, but the real man of the campaign was the Biffo, who now has established his credentials as the man to lead FF into the next election.
Wonderful to see Thatcher’s children getting stuffed, and particularly her number one child, the Irish electorate have decided that trickle down theory is a discredited economic policy and have shown them the door… feel sorry for some strong labour candidates but when your party stands for nothing anymore what do you expect.
Finally, your comments re Galway voters perhaps epitomised why FG will never lead a strong Govt in this country again, to tell the electorate that they are stupid is a PD strategy, to hear respected FG’ers (yes you are one) coming out with trip like that is just insulting.
Have a look back at my blog of last monday and you’ll see why there will be no alternative alliance, they people would not take the risk, I have a funny feeling it might be a long time before they ever do again.
P
P O'Neill said,
May 26, 2007 at 1:13 am
I think Sarah is right. The people get the government they deserve. They’ve voted for motorways that no one will use, electronic voting machines in indefinite storage, bacteria in the water in Galway, finances of a minister of finance/taoiseach that have taken 13 years and counting to figure out, houses with cardboard walls and no schools, Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness running Northern Ireland, and the notion that your problem is solved when the local minister writes a letter on your behalf. So go on holiday and let the 40 percents, plus the people who couldn’t be bothered voting when they could have, deal with the crowd of incompetents they’ve returned to power. Martin Cullen and Willlie O’Dea the top candidates for promotion in a new cabinet.
Paul said,
May 26, 2007 at 5:00 am
Sarah –with respect…despite everything — you as in you Sarah Carey, voted for GG as you number 1
So why should we take you seriouisly any more?
Sarah said,
May 26, 2007 at 9:30 am
Paul, you should never have taken me seriously
I am more convinced now than ever that Irish people are right wing. They have their little bit of money, and they are going to hold onto it and NO ONE underneath is to get a penny. It works the whole way down the food chain until you have the working/non-working classes who don’t want the immigrants to get anything.
I’m not taking back anything about Galway. Marine biologists begged the Dept. of the Environment ten years to do something about the water in Lough Corrib and they got run. If this is what the people in Galway want – low income tax and undrinkable water, then fine!
How can Joe Higgins not get re-elected? A fine, decent, honest man and a wonderful parliamentarian?
The people of Ireland can afford a wonderful quality of life and achieve equality of opportunity for everyone. If they don’t want it, then I meant what I said above – I’ll spend the children’s allowance and the SSIA and send my middle class children to college for free and quit feeling guilty about it.
Sarah said,
May 26, 2007 at 9:32 am
Oh you are right about Cowen btw. My heart sank at that Sunday press conferenc wit himself and Dermot Ahern and Michael Martin. It sank lower when he tore strips of Richard Bruton. He is the man. An ignorant man. But the man.
Paul Newton said,
May 26, 2007 at 11:09 am
Please don’t be mixing up your paul’s, I don’t cast judgements on people based on their personal voting patterns, I always thought that running GG was a mistake on FG’s part, but people’s voting patterns are often strategic as mine was in Sligo and it’s unfair to hammer people for attempting to vote as they wish.
Which is largely why the Galway vote went the way it did.
What’s sad about this election is the dissapearance of the left, and you are right about your point on immigrants, Mary Harney’s words will return to haunt Irish society, yes we are now more Boston than Berlin, and this election proved that beyond all doubt, Irish politics is now built on the adage… “I’m alright Jack…xxxx you”
We have followed the American (Reaganite) and British (Thatcherite) models of being a society based on individualism and individual responsibility, but in the words of Nelson Mandela, “a society should be judged not on how it treats it’s strongest citizens, but on how it treats it’s weakest” and if he’s right then economy might be in great shape but our society is in big trouble.
braz said,
May 26, 2007 at 11:10 am
I’d have to agree with P O’Neil and “The people get the government they deserve. ” but at the same time its simplistic as the people who wanted change voted for change. The Dail has split into two types of candidates, those who were elected by people who wanted local Councillors as TDs and those who were elected by people who wanted infrastructural, economic, healthcare and other broader national policy changes.
It’s a pity that many people still have difficulities in realising that TD’s are not local Councillors.
The Crewser said,
May 26, 2007 at 11:35 am
Sarah, I listened to you on Matt Coopers show. You were much more moderate than I would have thought. I have more respect for you now. Blogs can be misleading. But it was a great day for democracy. People power at work. Finally people had a chance to have their say and they did it in style. It was brilliant that there was widespread agreement that the Government had done a good job. Any other result would have been a traversty. The bitterness against Bertie was laid to rest finally and wasnt he gracious on TV last night. Worrying about the people who had lost their seats, from all sides.
41.5% was an absolutey brilliant return for FF better than anyone could have predicted. 39% would have been my maximum forecast and that would have been best scenario. Lets hope for a good stable Government for the next 5 years and continued prosperity for all as well as peace in our land.
FPL said,
May 26, 2007 at 1:34 pm
Hey “Crewser” you forgot …and jobs for the boys. Must have been a typo.
PaddyAnglican said,
May 26, 2007 at 1:52 pm
and what about: that we will all live happily ever after……….in the land of make believe.
The Crewser said,
May 26, 2007 at 5:53 pm
Don’t be such a bad loser Paddy
PaddyAnglican said,
May 26, 2007 at 6:22 pm
Its not over yet Crewser (Baby) – As I write this the Mayo Militia are being mobilized from their base in Rossport and are heading for the Capital. En route they will swop their slashhooks for the Sinn Fein weapons cache left behind by Mary Lou McDonald as she beat a hasty retreat from the battle for Dublin Central. The struggle continues…………
thepillionpassenger said,
May 26, 2007 at 9:10 pm
Cowen is the new McDowell – a condescending, arrogant bully. His gruffness may be amusing in isolation but when people see him defined by it they won’t be long about telling him where to go. Probably he will be the next Taoiseach but he doesn’t strike me as being able to pull off Bertie’s manofthepeople act.
thepillionpassenger said,
May 26, 2007 at 9:13 pm
Also I found bertie’s attack on journalists last night, when he said they are paid to write certain lines and need to be curbed, tasteless and worrying. More notable, perhaps, was how Sam Smyth didn’t pick up on it. At least John Boorman (sp?) did.
Gordon Davies said,
May 26, 2007 at 10:19 pm
Only consolation – there is not a stable majority available for BP Ahern. The gene pool is unstable – Bev Flynn will be bankrupt and out of the Dail in a month or two. That leaves the walking planning disater from Kerry and 2 dissidents from Dublin who will blackmail the Govt. The Greens are not a stable alternative. Sargeant, Gormley, White and all will balk at the prospect of embarking in the minsterial Merc to travel to Co Meath to cut the ribbon on the M3 and open the Tara Burger Palace and Paddywhackery Emporium… can you imagine FF accepting the Greens policy of putting an end to corporate donations. What would FF Ministers do in August if there was nobody to provide a helicopter to avoid the hoi-poloi(aka FF voter) at the Galway races.
So another election within 2 years.
Gordon
Dan Sullivan said,
May 26, 2007 at 11:07 pm
Crewser, people did not vote for the government. They did vote for FF in equal numbers to the last election but they abandoned the PDs, and the argument that the people wanted stable government and hence voted accordingly is nonsense. FF/PD were definitely stable and that government was not returned.
All credit to FF for fighting what was the right campaign for them, local and door to door, and blaming the PDs for the problems in the touchstone areas of health and crime. The mudguard worked.
I have to agree with a comment from Mairead McGuinness from yesterday, we need to make note of every promise made by FF during the course of the campaign whether at a local level (such as Noreen Ryan’s promise to waive legal fees for first time buyers), or national level (cutting PRSI in half) and run a clock from now to when they are fulfilled, if ever. And if FF abandon co-location now after the election then it would mean that they lied throughout the campaign.
CG said,
May 27, 2007 at 3:40 am
About the Irish being right-wing, I dunno. I think most people if you asked them would call themselves liberal and mean it.
But on the other hand I think people tend to fall back into a stupid knee-jerk, I’m clever, I don’t go along with the rest of the herd mentality. So that when it seemed like everyone was bashing Bertie and he was all out of favour, everyone suddenly thinks, ah, sure he’s not that bad, I’m going to be a bit of a rebel and support him.
Basically the thinking goes like this:
People as a whole are usually stupid. Majority opinion therefore is usually stupid. I’m not stupid. I’m a sophisticated thinker who doesn’t swim with the tide. Everyone thinks Bertie’s a crook! Well, they’re idiots. I like Bertie!
You see it loads in college. The stereotype is students are big lefties, so every eejit who wants to be perceived as sophisticated goes conservative. Muppets.
thepillionpassenger said,
May 27, 2007 at 8:20 am
You see it loads in college. The stereotype is students are big lefties, so every eejit who wants to be perceived as sophisticated goes conservative. Muppets.
haha true true
Dan Sullivan said,
May 27, 2007 at 11:57 am
Should someone put up signs on roads into Dublin for commuters returning home in the evening and going to work in the morning saying respectively if you had voted for the alternative you’d be home/ at work by now?
The Crewser said,
May 27, 2007 at 1:14 pm
The issues were put to the people forcefully by all sides and basically the story is that “the alternative government” was rejected completely and resoundingly. So Gordon don’t be clutching to straws, Bertie has lots of options now and throughout the next five years, and he certainly won’t be saving Mr Rabbittes hide by talking to him. Rabbitte nailed his colours to the mast a long time ago and by and large the public did not want him. It seems that many in Labour do not want him either. It will soon be bye bye Pat. The loss of McDowell is no great surprise (he may have filled the role of court jester lon enough) as his continued attacks on republicans were just a little too much to bear. The PDs as a serious electoral party are a thing of the past and I believe that next time around we will not see their logo.
The people of Ireland have rejected negative politics (attacks on Bertie, attacks on SF) and such like. The best thing that ever happened was Geraldine Kennedy illegally leaking the Tribunal information. That focused peoples minds and they gave that type of approach a definite thumbs down last Thursday. The Irish Electorate are now a sophisticated body of opinion and they will not have the wool pulled over their eyes by anyone. We have come too far from the dark days to throw it all away.
Dan Sullivan said,
May 27, 2007 at 2:22 pm
Crewser, the outgoing government is the block that lost the most seats not the alternative.
Mick O´Shea said,
May 28, 2007 at 7:59 am
It might not be so bad …
Maybe Bertie might think about his legacy now that he does not have to fight any more general elections (like Dev, I guess he will one day run for the park)
He might admit that OK you have a better feel for this public service stuff … lets see what you can do.
If Bertie goes with the Greens, then we might lose the two worst ministers … Trevor Sargent or John Gormley for Dick Roche and Eamon Ryan for Martin Cullen.
No PDs may mean the end of the co location nonsense in Health and we get this “stability” thing that is supposedly so important to everyone.
Ahhh … who am I kidding ..Beverly Cheesy Grin will be a junior minister … ZZZZZ.
CG said,
May 28, 2007 at 8:19 am
Hey Sarah, someone just told me Lucinda Creighton is against abortion, do you know if that’s true?
Dan Sullivan said,
May 28, 2007 at 9:13 am
You mean you read it on p.ie CG don’t you? Since when is that someone telling you anything?
irishpancake said,
May 28, 2007 at 9:15 am
Sarah
Could it be said that your No.1 GG fell at the first fence.
I don’t think we will see him again in Meath West.
But do not be down-hearted, as the Fine Gael Party has performed the best that could be expected.
The Alternative Government was let down by underperforming Greens and particularly Labour.
Surely the Labour Party has to re-examine the undermining of it’s traditional support due to the take-over by DL/Workers Party/SFWP rump.
What exactly has this cabal added to the LP.
No extra representation for sure.
The loss of quite a lot of dedicated old-style constituency workers, disgusted by the take-over of the leadership by the DL/WP faction.
Claire said,
May 28, 2007 at 9:23 am
Yes Lucinda creighton is against abortion- stated clearly on Vincent Browne 30th April, when they were discussing that most recent case. To be honest she sounded young, simplistic and to me ( a mother of 2 with one more on the way) it seemed obvious that it was all fairly theoretical to her.
BTW Sarah, take exception at the ‘people have failed themselves’ comment, we live in a democracy and can’t harp back to the idea that the public can’t make the right choices for themselves
CG said,
May 28, 2007 at 11:24 am
Well there you go. And I heard it from a friend, though whether he heard it on VB or read it on the internet I don’t know – some of us do still glean things from conversation Dan!
The Crewser said,
May 28, 2007 at 4:20 pm
For mostly proponents of the most right wing grouping in the Land (Fine Gael) it is a constant source of wonderment to me that there is a pseudo liberal theme running through almost all contributions. Perhaps you are all in the wrong parties. Not surprising then that there was no sign of a breakthrough for “the alternative” Government. The voting public can see this kind of thing. FG only recovered some of their losses from 2002, now that could hardly be described as a breakthrough.
FPL said,
May 28, 2007 at 9:53 pm
Ah lads could you give it a rest, the war is over.
The Crewser said,
May 28, 2007 at 11:33 pm
I would love to but the devil in me wants to keep it going for another five years or so. I’m fascinated that there are contributors to this site complaining that Lucinda Creighton is anti abortion. I would have presumed most right thinking people would be or have FG done another somersault when I was catching a nap. Good heavens this political stuff is great.
Tom N said,
May 29, 2007 at 12:00 am
Too many opinions, not enough discussion!
So my only comment is my contention with the “people get the government they deserve” rubbish. Everybody has the same government so does everybody in Ireland deserve this? I have voted against that idiot Ahern (darn those libel laws – wait until after Mahon) at every opportunity. I don’t deserve it. Countries that have good government have their numbnuts also. Only logical conclusion is that none deserves the government they get!
The Crewser said,
May 29, 2007 at 6:52 am
This is typical of the attitude which was roundly rejected by the Irish voting public. The tribunal became politicised on the side of FG / Labour and is now a lame duck. But its the only thing that the losers in the Election can cling to now. Idiot says it all
Claire said,
May 29, 2007 at 3:01 pm
Crewser
I wasn’t complaining that LC was anti abortion – just confirming that she was. But I do find it hard to believe that any thinking person would expect that 17 year old with the anacephalic baby to carry full term knowing the dire prognosis.
Also, have to state categorically that not everyone on the site is FG – as you can imagine some of us just log in due to a perverse curiosity about trying to understand the minds of those who are!!
student said,
May 29, 2007 at 3:36 pm
“I am more convinced now than ever that Irish people are right wing. They have their little bit of money, and they are going to hold onto it and NO ONE underneath is to get a penny.”
I agree that the Irish are relatively right wing but this kind of crypto-socialism is bizarre coming from a FG supporter. You must accept the strong argument that the Government needs to spend the substantial amounts of money it already receives better, before being given more.
I don’t agree with reducing income tax any further, for example, but neither do I believe a government of any colour should be given blank cheques.
With regard to the comment about commuters – when will politicians stand up to some of these people? It’s a personal choice to live in the outskirts. Ok, services and amenities are crap in some areas but if you’re going to take the word of a developer’s brochure on that it’s your own loss. There are great schools in Dublin city, for example, with loads of empty seats. The “priced-out” argument is rubbish – go on Daft/MyHome now and there is plenty of affordability in many areas, surrounded by conveniences and amenities. It is snobbery that stops people living in certain places. Do not subject all of us to your boring rants because you chose to live in a field.
Newstalk had a stunt a week or so ago where they had a reporter accompany a commuter from Navan or somewhere … I have 0% sympathy. As for the woman who texted in about the amount of time it takes to commute from CAVAN to DUBLIN! Stupidity is not the fault of the Government, nor is it their job to accommodate every whim of the idiot.
Tom said,
May 31, 2007 at 9:13 am
Student’s naivety is incredible. Many friends have decided to make the compromise, living in poorer areas. Would he then advise them to go and cop on a live in areas with less social problems such as Cavan or Carlow? It is not snobbery to wish the best for your children. Of course there are great people everywhere, but having done a huge amount of work in North Inner City Dublin, I sure as hell would not want to raise kids there. Don’t tell me that Dominic Street is as good a place to raise a family as Cavan town or Carlow.
Student you need to live in the real world. As a single man I can live anywhere (within reason) for moderate rent. But when you have a familiy to think of, shoes, doctors bills etc, you have to accept that you have to prioritise differently!
student said,
May 31, 2007 at 9:16 am
Thanks for your overwhelming condescension. Despite my moniker, I am not a student by the way.
Due to searching for a place to own myself, I have watched Daft and MyHome rigorously in recent months. There ARE options, not just in the North Inner City. Sure, compromises may have to be made on space or gardens, etc., but compromises are most certainly being made by those living in far-flung dormitory developments.
And, knowing Cavan and Carlow towns, it is debatable whether they are better places to raise children – this depends on your outlook.
While I take some of your comments, I am disgusted by your tone.
CG said,
May 31, 2007 at 8:05 pm
Oh get over yourself student. Tom’s right. YOU might think that issues like ’space’ and ‘gardens’ can be compromised, but you won’t when you have two or three kids. You do realise that ’space’ means enough bedrooms? ‘Gardens’ means room to go outside? Wanting these things isn’t snobbery. It’s a fact that young people everywhere in the country can no longer afford to live in the area they grew up in. They deserve good amenities in the areas they’ve been forced into.
You SAY it’s all their fault and they shouldn’t have relied on the developer’s brochure. But that developer didn’t just decide to set up shop in a field. He got PLANNING PERMISSION, which means that there ought to have been facilities in place for the new houses. We CAN blame politicians for the fact that there isn’t.
(And btw I’m probably younger than you are and am still Dublin-based – but I can still empathise with people in different situations to me).
Sean said,
June 1, 2007 at 8:01 am
>It’s a fact that young people everywhere in the country can no longer >afford to live in the area they grew up in
I’d say the majority of people nationwide can afford to live in the area that they grew up in.
liam said,
June 1, 2007 at 11:54 am
Where a person choses to live is dependent on a number of variables, space, garden, nearness to elderly parents and family, proximity to work, etc and I agree that it is a personal choice that everyone has to make.
However the quality of life for that person after he/she has made that choice is, in many cases, dependant on politicians.Taking the example of the commuter from Navan given by student above; this commuter was made a promise by Noel Dempsey in 1999 that a rail link to Navan would be operating by 2004. By 2005 this became a vague promise for 2015 (!!) added onto the end of Transport 21 and now, in 2007, even that date is starting to feel more and more unrealistic.
So it the person who bought in towns like Navan with the expectation that a modern economy like Ireland’s would have, at the very least, a rail link to one of its capital’s major satellite towns, supposed to stay quiet when he/she dosn’t see this happen, as you (student) seem to suggest?
It seems, according to you, student, that that person has no right to feel aggrieved at this, at another false promise from their government, has no right to try to highlight this issue as often as possible, has no right to try to improve the quality of life for their family and the families around them.
Your argument seems to be you bought there, like it or lump it, but don’t expect anything from the government, don’t expect adequate schools, playgrounds for your kids, proper planning, a modern public transport system (even though we won’t be bringing any jobs near you, they’re all in Dublin, doncha know, sure you’ll make it there eventually).
Yet still Meath elect 4 FFs!!! I really don’t get it.
CG said,
June 1, 2007 at 7:26 pm
“Apologies for not falling into line with your Joe Duffy opinions” Grow up you big eejit. Stop sulking just because we disagreed with you.
How exactly do you expect the Navan woman to take ‘personal responsibility’ for the absence of a rail link? Ought she to get out her spade and start building herself? I think raising awareness of the fact she was promised it and it isn’t there IS taking personal responsibility. Buying a house half the size that’s falling apart in some corner of Dublin isn’t ‘personal responsibility’, it’s a stupid decision that people with families can’t afford to make.
Sean, I don’t know about being able to live where they grew up. It’s not true in all cases but most people I think aren’t able to buy the houses their parents bought at their age.
andrew said,
June 2, 2007 at 10:04 am
There’s an interesting debate here, if people would stop having personal digs at each other.
There was an academic – didn’t catch the name – from Maynooth NUI on radio recently, who said she’d been visiting the new Adamstown development, near Lucan, with a group of undergraduates. The idea is that Adamstown contains a mixture of one, two and three-bedroom apartments, with schools, playgrounds, shops, railway station etc. It’s hoped that people will buy starter homes and then, as families arrive and expand, will trade up within the neighbourhood rather than look for a semi-d thirty miles away.
The undergraduates, presumably the generation for whom these homes are intended, were unimpressed. Where were the individual, private front and back gardens? The academic pointed out the planning difficulties and chronic car-dependency of the front-and-back-garden model. They were unmoved. Paris or Rome can have families of all sizes living in city apartments, playing in parks and playgrounds, taking public transport to school, shopping in neighbourhood shops. We show few signs yet of recognising the long-term unsustainability of the quarter-acre-and-two-cars-per-household way of life.
On the other hand, of course, there’s little incentive to make town and city life more attractive to families, when the dormitory suburbs seem to be endorsing, in the election, the current model, and when the government’s best friends, the builders, are sitting on thousands of acres of greenfield sites. Double the price of petrol and see where we stand.
leon said,
June 5, 2007 at 11:56 am
CG when our parents were my age (mid thirties) there was a great deal of emigration.
You are assuming that you would earn the salary you earn now then and that you would earn it here (if you follow me).
The reality is that many of the people buying houses here and now would have been buying them in Luton or Kirkcaldy 20 years ago.
I am unable to live where I grew up (Rathmines) because I don’t earn enough to live there. end of story. It is more expensive because there is money being made here. when i was a kid the area was about genteel (and not so genteel) poverty and now it is nouveau riche. To my mind that’s progress.
Andrew: You only need to look at Ballymun.
‘front door, back door, front garden, back garden everything else is bullshit’
andrew said,
June 5, 2007 at 12:08 pm
How do families live in Paris, New York, Hong Kong…?
Breakfast Roll Man said,
June 6, 2007 at 8:51 am
Well Done Sarah – with a blog like this you’re the best PR that FF could ever have wished for! Ever thought of forming a PR company with Vincent Browne? PJ Meara would be out of a job tomorrow!
You’re Not in the Hist Now.
Tom said,
June 7, 2007 at 2:16 pm
BRM,
What an utterly ridiculous and facetious remark. I came across numerous FF gombeen men in recent weeks. However I do not think a blog is a forum for opinions. It is a forum for discussion. I would be more than happy to provide you with countless funny stories. Please don’t confuse your own opinion for educated reflection.
Kindest regards,
Tom
Sarah said,
June 8, 2007 at 8:03 pm
Hi guys, well what fun you’ve been having!
BRM – I was in the Phil scuze me. (though did speak at the Hist).
I say cheers! to the Greens. After all my dire and consistently inaccurate predicitons, they’ve told the FnFers to piss off. Well done. Principals before mercs. I might even join up.
The Crewser said,
June 10, 2007 at 11:20 am
Thank god we are not going to have a “green” element in the new Government. That bunch of tree huggers would have us back in the ass and cart again. We have come much too far in terms of our living standards to have them put in jeopardy by a bunch of weirdos who were given no mandate by the Irish people to dictate what type of policies should or should not be implemented over the next five years. But of course Sarah you will jump on any bandwagon there is rolling to have a dig at FF. You may as well join the Greens Sarah as they are likely to be as successful as your current lot (Enda and FG) at convincing the electorate that they have anything worthwhile to offer them. Its a bit like changing deck chairs on the Titanic.
andrew said,
June 10, 2007 at 2:20 pm
So the Greens are ‘a bunch of weirdos who were given no mandate by the Irish people to dictate what type of policies should or should not be implemented over the next five years’, Crewser? No danger of Mary Harney being allowed to continue her run of successes at the health department, then.
The Crewser said,
June 10, 2007 at 8:24 pm
Andrew, there is a world of a difference between the responsible attitude of the PD’s (even with a two TD’s ) and that of the Greens (wacky and irresponsible) When the Election took place on May 24th the Irish electorate had a clear choice and they certainly did not give the Greens any mandate to impose their destructive policies on the Irish Nation. Instead they voted for a continuation of the successful policies of the outgoing Government.
Irish people are clearly in favour of developing infrastructure which is so vital to this country’s future. The Greens want to disrupt this programme and therefore there is no place for them or their ilk in the forthcoming Government. This is just one issue, there are many others but on this matter alone they automatically exclude themselves from power in this Country. And Andrew I can see Mary Harney resuming her duties in Health in a few weeks time. Reform is required in this area and it will continue to be delivered.
liam said,
June 10, 2007 at 9:29 pm
“Instead they voted for a continuation of the successful policies of the outgoing Government.”
Really, Crewser? Why did the PDs lose six of their eight seats then? Hardly a ringing endorsement of their successful policies.
You may have spoken too soon about the Greens too, if today’s developments are anything to go by.
Tom said,
June 11, 2007 at 10:43 am
Mandate? Everybody who gets elected has a mandate of some description. You can argue that the PD’s have a mandate as thier only minister got reelected. You can argue that FF have a mandate as they have the most TDs. You can argue that FG have a mandate, as they were the only party to increase their number of Dail seats. You can argue that SF have a mandate as they still have four sitting TDs. This thread has turned into a “who can shout the loudest” forum. You can argue that Labour have a mandate as their vote held (inspite of loss of one seat) and they did quite well in some constituencies. But there is one glaring reality which seems to have eluded the posters here. Only the Dail can elect the government. Arguing here about mandates is “as useful as pockets are to a dog”.
The Crewser said,
June 11, 2007 at 2:40 pm
Tom lets get back to the real world here for a minute. The only ones who have a mandate to run the country and govern for the next five years are those who can actually form a Government when the moment comes. Enda Kenny and Pat Rabbitte put forward their alternative to the parties in power. They were roundly rejected by the electorate. The Mullingar Accord, The Contract were all given the thumbs down by the Irish People. Its not rocket science Tom Bertie and FF were given the mandate to continue to Govern as they had done successfully for the last 10 years. Its an incredible achievement I know. Hard to stomach for a lot of diehard anti FF people.
But its a fact. Get over it, Enda will have to, so will Pat. Its nothing to do with shouting loudest, its democracy, very painful for some but its the best system around.
Tom said,
June 11, 2007 at 3:44 pm
Crewser,
You have just proved my point about reasoned argument being replaced by opinions. I fully accept that FF are almost certain to lead the next government. However my contention is with the forum here, which is truly a wonderful website and up until now has been wonderfully entertaining, superbly written by Sarah, occasionally controversial, but always addictive.
I think anyone who reads your posts and sees your contention that the PDs have more of a mandate than the Greens will have their mind made up about my point. I don’t like the Greens especially, but Greens 6, PDs 2…it’s hard to see any form of logic in your argument.
No doubt you will want the last word, so knock yourself out. My contention that argument and discussion has been replaced with opinion still stands. I am now just waiting for you to prove my point!
Tom said,
June 11, 2007 at 3:51 pm
Crewser,
Forgot to mention:
Outgoing govertment parties before election: 88 seats.
Outgoing goverment parties after election: 80 seats.
I get the feeling that you will blame the Greens for the economic downturn!
Election Outcome - reasons to be cheerful. » Blog Archive » BifSniff said,
June 23, 2007 at 1:39 am
[...] spotted this now – a quote from Sarah Carey on why she is cheerful despite Fianna Fail being back in government… So why am I cheerful? Because I’ve decided to stop feeling guilty about the children’s [...]